what's going up in Cobh

Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby THE_Chris » Tue Dec 19, 2006 2:54 am

That one Im in favour of, assuming the appartments look ok. The sheds look terrible as it stands. They should do something cool with the waterfront access of it tho, like have a little marina for the appartments.
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby samuel j » Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:26 pm

THE_Chris wrote:That one Im in favour of, assuming the appartments look ok. The sheds look terrible as it stands. They should do something cool with the waterfront access of it tho, like have a little marina for the appartments.


Couldn't agree with you more. for about 10 years there were rumours of all sorts of plans for there but nothing happened. At last something on the cards as the shed are a real eyesore.

A pontoon upriver/downriver arrangement would enhance it but it is quite close to the actual channel so not sure of anything wider would be allowed. can get lumpy/nasty there in stong northerlies so would have to be a decent weight of pontoon.
But overall hope it goes ahead as derelict sheds just awful
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby corcaighboy » Tue Dec 19, 2006 4:21 pm

Here is an aerial shot of the area in question....alas, the view is more of the Monkstown side and not the Rushbrooke side. Still, gives an interesting view nonetheless.
Image
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby samuel j » Tue Dec 19, 2006 4:31 pm

corcaighboy]Here is an aerial shot of the area in question....alas, the view is more of the Monkstown side and not the Rushbrooke side. Still, gives an interesting view nonetheless.


Excellent shot, you can see at the bottom the sheds in question which derelict for years and the yards
which in a bit of a mess, so anything has to be better than this as the first thing many a tourist sees if coming on the ferry to Cobh.
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby Gianlorenzo » Wed Dec 20, 2006 12:20 am

What you are not seeing in the little lodge across from the sheds - angle too steep. I wonder if that is where the objection is coming from.
I have to say I am torn on this question. While I would be delighed to see the eyesore eliminated, in my heart I cannot get excited about more apartments.
One has to wonder if that is all we can think about anymore. Surely given the wonderful location we could come up with something a little more interesting and communal than appartments.:confused:
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby samuel j » Wed Dec 20, 2006 1:17 am

Gianlorenzo wrote:What you are not seeing in the little lodge across from the sheds - angle too steep. I wonder if that is where the objection is coming from.
I have to say I am torn on this question. While I would be delighed to see the eyesore eliminated, in my heart I cannot get excited about more apartments.
One has to wonder if that is all we can think about anymore. Surely given the wonderful location we could come up with something a little more interesting and communal than appartments.:confused:


There is indeed a lovely cottage there and you could be right. as to communal use, I think this opportunity is long gone.. I recall years ago that after the Trawler/fishing boat yard closed this land ended up in county council or UCD ownership...... so some public owned it or had the opportunity at soem stage in its history.

Problem is now is that it has been left go to rack and ruin so appartment or not something has to happen, the chance was there for something public
....
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby goldiefish » Thu Dec 21, 2006 7:26 am

If I remember correctly, Maritem closed down before Verolme, sometime around 1985? (last vessel built was the trawler "Fr Oliver") It is shameful that it was allowed remain derelict for so long.

I remember well the bow/stem of newbuild vessels protruding from the larger hut onto the main road. Their Launching framework still remains on the foreshore, though much of the offices were knocked to make room for the Ferry slipway.

However, they continue to build houses, houses houses all around Great Island with little in the way of other facilities. The one road in and out of the island gets worse daily. Not even a cinema. The "old" town centre still has unoccupied frontage, boarded up awaiting new occupants. The majority of the new residential areas access the main Cork-Cobh road on wat is possibly the worst T Junction in the country, Not far from the Maritem site. Nothing resembling an industrial park of any sort. The Dockyard remains the only major industrial land on the Island, but there have been many efforts in the past to Knock it too and build houses on the site.(Premier Homes are currently located there, which ironically holds its place as an industrial site for now).
The entire Island is becoming one big dormotory, with no community spirit, no industry, even its famous drinking establishments are in decline (the Holy Ground is not what it used to be).
Apartments, in the modern sense also usually restrict parking spaces to the bare minimum, forcing the occupants to use the already at full capacity public transport, to commute to the city, or other "Mainland" locations.

I still can't understand how they get away with it.
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby Praxiteles » Thu Dec 21, 2006 10:20 am

goldiefish wrote:If I remember correctly, Maritem closed down before Verolme, sometime around 1985? (last vessel built was the trawler "Fr Oliver") It is shameful that it was allowed remain derelict for so long.

I remember well the bow/stem of newbuild vessels protruding from the larger hut onto the main road. Their Launching framework still remains on the foreshore, though much of the offices were knocked to make room for the Ferry slipway.

However, they continue to build houses, houses houses all around Great Island with little in the way of other facilities. The one road in and out of the island gets worse daily. Not even a cinema. The "old" town centre still has unoccupied frontage, boarded up awaiting new occupants. The majority of the new residential areas access the main Cork-Cobh road on wat is possibly the worst T Junction in the country, Not far from the Maritem site. Nothing resembling an industrial park of any sort. The Dockyard remains the only major industrial land on the Island, but there have been many efforts in the past to Knock it too and build houses on the site.(Premier Homes are currently located there, which ironically holds its place as an industrial site for now).
The entire Island is becoming one big dormotory, with no community spirit, no industry, even its famous drinking establishments are in decline (the Holy Ground is not what it used to be).
Apartments, in the modern sense also usually restrict parking spaces to the bare minimum, forcing the occupants to use the already at full capacity public transport, to commute to the city, or other "Mainland" locations.

I still can't understand how they get away with it.


I think that I may know the answer to that!!
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby Spinal Tap » Thu Dec 21, 2006 11:21 am

goldiefish wrote:If I remember correctly, Maritem closed down before Verolme, sometime around 1985? (last vessel built was the trawler "Fr Oliver") It is shameful that it was allowed remain derelict for so long.

I remember well the bow/stem of newbuild vessels protruding from the larger hut onto the main road. Their Launching framework still remains on the foreshore, though much of the offices were knocked to make room for the Ferry slipway.

However, they continue to build houses, houses houses all around Great Island with little in the way of other facilities. The one road in and out of the island gets worse daily. Not even a cinema. The "old" town centre still has unoccupied frontage, boarded up awaiting new occupants. The majority of the new residential areas access the main Cork-Cobh road on wat is possibly the worst T Junction in the country, Not far from the Maritem site. Nothing resembling an industrial park of any sort. The Dockyard remains the only major industrial land on the Island, but there have been many efforts in the past to Knock it too and build houses on the site.(Premier Homes are currently located there, which ironically holds its place as an industrial site for now).
The entire Island is becoming one big dormotory, with no community spirit, no industry, even its famous drinking establishments are in decline (the Holy Ground is not what it used to be).
Apartments, in the modern sense also usually restrict parking spaces to the bare minimum, forcing the occupants to use the already at full capacity public transport, to commute to the city, or other "Mainland" locations.

I still can't understand how they get away with it.


Cobh has massive potential and could have eclipse Kinsale which 25 yrs ago was in a poor state apparently.
Cobh has great architecture,fantastic setting at mouth of harbour,facing south and ther should be thriving restaurants,bars,tourist related industries etc.The lack of moorings for yachts does'nt help,neglected and empty shops,too many awful bars,rubbish new housing,the main road is just dangerous and neglected.
A tourism plan must be drawin up and implemented which has to include Cobh,Crosshaven and Roches point a part of the Spike Island shheme if it ever happens.Cobh people need a few more options like cinema,sports,employment facilities,social facilities etc.
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby samuel j » Thu Dec 21, 2006 12:34 pm

Spinal Tap wrote:Cobh has massive potential and could have eclipse Kinsale which 25 yrs ago was in a poor state apparently.
Cobh has great architecture,fantastic setting at mouth of harbour,facing south and ther should be thriving restaurants,bars,tourist related industries etc.The lack of moorings for yachts does'nt help,neglected and empty shops,too many awful bars,rubbish new housing,the main road is just dangerous and neglected.
A tourism plan must be drawin up and implemented which has to include Cobh,Crosshaven and Roches point a part of the Spike Island shheme if it ever happens.Cobh people need a few more options like cinema,sports,employment facilities,social facilities etc.


I couldn't agree with you more.
We have at last a decent Pool and Gym akin to one out by CIT in Cork. It took time but there at last. Cinema
kills me to drive off the Island to Mahon, Douglas or Midleton with da kids to see latest kiddies movie.
We had one for years, down by the baths. I and all my pals grew up with one...one we walked to and walked home...not a car in sight.....

I still feel the key is a marina (I am biased I admit as keen yottie/boatie) as based on what I've seen in UK
Scotland and other Irish ports, all pubs and restaurants got their act together once the punters started coming by sea and very often families to join up with boat by land. Everyone benefits.
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby THE_Chris » Fri Dec 22, 2006 12:39 am

Three years ago I went up Cobh Cathedral on a beautiful day. The pics of the inside of the Cathedral are in the other thread, here are the pics of the views. A lots changed since these were taken but its some nice views of Cobh three years ago :D

West, towards Convent ->

Image

West, towards Bishops House ->

Image

East - Cathedral Carpark and Mount ->

Image

Slightly North of that ->

Image

East again ->

Image

Plenty more pics to come :)
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby samuel j » Fri Dec 22, 2006 12:46 am

once again brillant stuff, thanks for sharing them.....really great stuff to study..
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby samuel j » Fri Dec 22, 2006 3:02 am

Social Welfare Office cobh

This is from theOPUS Assessor's Report 06 6/11/06 10:56 AM Page 2
Bank of Ireland Opus
Architecture and Construction Awards 2006
Assessor’s Report
"Highly-Commended
Project: Cobh Social Welfare Office, Cobh, Co Cork
Architect: Architectural Services, Office of Public Works, Dublin
Contractor: Cummor Construction, Blarney, Co Cork
The old Custom House in Cobh, once boarded up, has been carefully
restored and
extended. Its new life as a social welfare building brings an interplay of
continuity and
evolution between the restored old building and the carefully-inserted
new building.
Significant street level differences are boldly bridged, breathing new life
into an important
town.
The quality of restoration, research, design and building are of a
high standard.
OPUS Assessor's Report 06 6/11/06 10:56 AM Page 10

In case we forget the following shots show the beautiful restored south facing old Custom house
and the 2nd shot is the telly tubbie tv they have 'carefully-inserted' on back or north facing towards Harbour row..

What do you think..?
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby Praxiteles » Fri Dec 22, 2006 3:11 am

If this is the kind of judgement used by the Bank of Ireland in minding your hard earned shillings for you, I think I would advise you to go before closure tomorrow (Friday) and draw out everything. It might not be there after Christmas after having been carefully inserted into a stupid investment! Do not say that you have not been warned! The Telly-tubby says it all.
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby Gianlorenzo » Fri Dec 22, 2006 5:04 am

Albeit that this thread is called 'What is going up in Cobh', of interest lately is what is coming down. There have been two landslides in the town recently.
The first involved the garden of one of the houses in the Crescent landing down in the yard of the hardware store at the bottom of West View. It was miraculous that no one was hurt. A car and a forklift were buried. Apparently there was a second slide near Bellevue School but I do not know the details.
Seemingly the council have been trying to get money from the Government for this problem, but so far nothing.
I suppose someone will have to die - ( one young man had a lucky escape in that he had just vacated the above mentioned forklift when the slide occurred) or they will need an EU directive banning hills.
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby Praxiteles » Fri Dec 22, 2006 10:19 am

As far as I am aware the Irish government used to maintain a fund called The Cobh Subsidence Relief Fund. What has happened to it?

And BTW I understand that works are going on at Cathedral terrace to secure the foundations of one of the parochial houses. I wonder has it crossed any one's mind to to have an engineer check the foundations of the Cathedral platform for subsidence problems?
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby phil » Fri Dec 22, 2006 12:26 pm

samuel j wrote:
In case we forget the following shots show the beautiful restored south facing old Custom house
and the 2nd shot is the telly tubbie tv they have 'carefully-inserted' on back or north facing towards Harbour row..

What do you think..?


Whilst I always find it hard to judge buildings based on photos alone, I certainly wouldn't rush to criticise this building as much as it has been by other users of these forums. It seems to fit comfortably in the site in which it has been located. The restoration of the other building looks good also.
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby samuel j » Fri Dec 22, 2006 12:43 pm

phil wrote:Whilst I always find it hard to judge buildings based on photos alone, I certainly wouldn't rush to criticise this building as much as it has been by other users of these forums. It seems to fit comfortably in the site in which it has been located. The restoration of the other building looks good also.


It is hard to judge form photos alone and you are right the restoration of the Custom House/Mercantile Marine offices is splendi. It was derelict for years as a few different ideas were looked at by the OPW. At one stage there was talk it would become the new garda station.
Anyway I fully agree the restoration fo this building and section is excellent work but (and I know the photos don't give the full impression) the back building they inserted/linked to the custom house, now opening out to
the junction by Harbour Row, looks terrible when you see the buildings surrounding it.

Strangely enough it breaks many of the points the Town development plan recommends as criteria for in-town developments.

Page 11 of Volume 2
"All developments must be designed to complement the existing
architecture, townscape and character. Where a new building is to
be inserted into a street or an existing building is to be altered, the
character and integrity of the street facade is to be maintained.
Development must respect the proportion and character of the
existing streetscape including architectural features such as
plaster surrounds to windows, quoins, etc. In general large sheets
of plate glass should be avoided.
As a general rule, flat roofed buildings, single storey development
or bland facades, will not be permitted on the street frontages in
this area."
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby phil » Fri Dec 22, 2006 12:58 pm

Would I be right in saying that this development is at the end of a terrace of shops/houses which front straight on to the street at? If this is the caseI think it works well in that it merges the terrace with the rest of the road without taking away from the existing structures. It would seem that they would have had difficulty if they had decided to go more than one storey due to the amount of windows on the gable of the building beside it. As I say, it is hard to judge without seeing it in the flesh, but I think it looks quite positive from the images presented.
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby samuel j » Fri Dec 22, 2006 2:03 pm

phil wrote:Would I be right in saying that this development is at the end of a terrace of shops/houses which front straight on to the street at? If this is the caseI think it works well in that it merges the terrace with the rest of the road without taking away from the existing structures. It would seem that they would have had difficulty if they had decided to go more than one storey due to the amount of windows on the gable of the building beside it. As I say, it is hard to judge without seeing it in the flesh, but I think it looks quite positive from the images presented.


Yes and light to windows next door would have stopped 2 storey, however that attached photo might give you idea of whats straight across from it. It would be on the bottom left of this photo.
Will try to get more shots over Xmas

Have a good Xmas
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby Praxiteles » Fri Dec 22, 2006 2:56 pm

phil wrote:Would I be right in saying that this development is at the end of a terrace of shops/houses which front straight on to the street at? If this is the caseI think it works well in that it merges the terrace with the rest of the road without taking away from the existing structures. It would seem that they would have had difficulty if they had decided to go more than one storey due to the amount of windows on the gable of the building beside it. As I say, it is hard to judge without seeing it in the flesh, but I think it looks quite positive from the images presented.


I am afraid that I have to disagree with this view. I can see no inherent aesthetic quality in this development which detracts from the environment into which it has been imposed without any consideration or sympathy for the period buildings on the street. It is basically a bit of crap: one part looks like the back of an old-fashioned outside jacks; another like a discarded television box, and the third element looks like a stupidly placed flower box. It might work were one to demolish the rest of the street - a proposition not entirely beyond the Cobh Urban District Council!
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby phil » Fri Dec 22, 2006 3:12 pm

samuel j wrote:Yes and light to windows next door would have stopped 2 storey, however that attached photo might give you idea of whats straight across from it. It would be on the bottom left of this photo.
Will try to get more shots over Xmas

Have a good Xmas


Thanks for posting that image Samuel. There is something very subtle about that small building at the centre of the shot. It connects the two streets beautifully. The steps are also a nice feature.

Thanks for Christmas wishes. Have a good one yourself.

Phil
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby THE_Chris » Fri Dec 22, 2006 8:49 pm

More 2003 pics from up the Cathedral -

Looking north -

Image

West, Bishops house again -

Image

Southeast -

Image

South, Oil Refinery across the harbor -

Image

East, the mount and the road next to it -

Image
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby samuel j » Fri Dec 22, 2006 10:18 pm

Once again The_Chris great photos, rare views to get ..thanks for sharing.
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Re: what's going up in Cobh

Postby THE_Chris » Sun Dec 24, 2006 8:33 pm

I think I liked that view of the Mount -

Image

East -

Image

Northeast, towards the water towers -

Image

North -

Image

West -

Image
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